Thank you for this article, and huge congrats on the NYT feature. It made me reflect on how tricky it is to really nail the fit on a pair of pants. I'm sitting here in a pair of olive straight cut herringbone work pants from Corridor, and to be honest I was a few eBay taps away from unloading this pair last year because I thought the leg opening was "too wide." Somehow I persevered, and pushed my personal boundaries, and they've become my BEST-FITTING PANTS. The combination of the straight cut, substantial-but-not-too-heavy drape, and cinch-able waist are a killer combination.
Even with advances in AI, achieving the right break on a pair of pants somehow remains an intricate balancing act - too long and everything's bunched, too short and you are the equivalent of a pant-wearing "Fred", and mamma mia when you swap out low-cut sneaks for boots everything can go haywire. Writing this Comment, I also realize it's easy to get caught up in the technical details of fabric weight, inseam lengths, cuts, and so on, and lose sight of the enjoyment of getting it right.
One element that didn't get covered too extensively is time-and-place. When I'm out to dinner with my folks and the lady, perhaps the slightly trimmer look makes me feel most comfortable. And when I'm walking around town on a Saturday afternoon, maybe I want to let the leg openings flutter in the wind a bit more. This adds yet another dimension to the complexity of nailing the right fit, but also presents an opportunity to utilize different widths on different occasions, which does feel freeing.
I’ll always love wide leg pants, but I don’t love hemming them to match the height of a specific shoe. In that sense, wide legs can be pretty limiting. I wonder if skinny pants may never fully recede in part because they allow for total shoe height / pant break freedom.
Never really rocked skinnies as a youth (cause I was too young) but it’s crazy to remember how Cheap Monday had a chokehold on cool baby rocker European youth !! It was part of the wave mixing skinny vintage and brands like AA and April 77, with this weird reinterpretation of the “rock” aesthetic through the 50 to the 90s, which feels non-existent today and outdated (except maybe for the use of hardcore aesthetics), but it might very well comeback
I feel like this article and your one before about aging out of certain looks goes hand in hand. Although I am in much better shape now than I am when I was rocking skinny-er jeans, as I get older, comfort is king, really hard to sit down for a long chat with an old friend when your junk is getting crushed for an hour. My other hesitation with the skinny jean coming back is, with the crappier manufacturing and materials the future likely brings, ass seam tears will be inevitable!
one thing skinny pants will never have is max utility. easy to rock big pants in the mountains or climbing gym and then step back into the city looking great. can’t imagine going back to hindering my movement with tiny pants….
Fit preferences aside, big slappers will always have an edge over slims in the intrigue dept. That extra fabric creates (literal) space for architectural tailoring moments and getting freaky with materials. I look at a brand like 18 east and can’t imagine any of those fabrics cut down to a slim silhouette, wrestling my calves with each step (maybe I just don’t have the vision?). I can’t say with total certainty that I’ll never buy another pair of petit standards, but I’m definitely never rockin another pair of slim fit corduroys.
I have rocked my black skinnies tucked into knee high boots in an equestrian sort of look once recently. I don’t think it looked amazing but I was having a hard day and it was comforting.
Recently got a pair of straight Denham jeans in Amsterdam. They feel skinny in our big pants world but look sooo sexy and feel transgressive. Also got a pair of ultra low rise flared true religions off poshmark for like $20 during lockdown times. The zipper is legit 1in! I think I also recently donated them in an adderall induced closet clearing fury (off my meds now BH, didn’t work for me), and was sad because I wanted to wear them last weekend and couldn’t find them :( might repurchase for a few reasons.
I will say, Jonah, I like both of your fits in the picture above. Me? I probably hit the middle of the road compared to you as far as pants—neither skinny nor max width. Does that make me 'never in fashion but never out of fashion,' either? I feel confident in what I rock, which goes as far as being in style or having the right brands of the moment. I was wearing JNCO in the 90s, Tsubi's in the 00s and now, Japanese raw with some decent leg room. Awesome write up by the way!
I love a wide-legged pant, particularly ones with pleating and a belt to dress up or down. I wore a pair with big ol' swish to an event this weekend with a simple tucked-in solid shirt and mary jane flats and felt sharp as hell.
Slim-straight-leg cuffed jeans over boots on men or women have me in a chokehold, though. I still like this look when it's rugged. The jeans can't be TOO slim, though, and I prefer lace-up boots with this fit.
If you look back on an article in The Cut from around 2012 where they paid homage to my style icon, Katherine Hepburn, she pretty much always rocked the larger trousers. From the 30s to the 80s, her pants always leaned more towards baggy or flowy, nary a skinny cigarette style in sight. Sure she had some straighter leg cuts, but they still had movement. I think one can stick to a pants style across decades. I never owned a single pair of skinny or flared pants, ever. So maybe I’m just trying to justify my style. LOL.
I’ll honestly never tire of talking about pants - I need therapy. I personally do not ever see myself wearing skinnies again, as I don’t feel they suit my body type. I’m much broader on top and look as though I’m about to fall over when wearing skinnies. I’m also super tired of them - they never really left for many people.
Words of wisdom! Would also love to hear your thoughts (and perhaps Erin can weigh in) on how shirt fits (both horizontal and vertical) are changing in response to larger pants fits. Especially for women’s fits — if ladies are wearing large pants slung low, and especially if we don’t want to be showing midriff for whatever reason, where should our shirts be hitting our hips? And do shirts need to be wider or narrower to balance out the larger fit on the bottom half? Really struggling with this. Would make a great follow up piece.
like ELK says above, the 'out'ness of skinnies isn't just a 'how do they work' problem, it's an associations problem - they started off c. 2004-06 being worn by the cooler parts of Young Hollywood and the kind of people who would be photographed on street style blogs when those were legit, by 2016 even the corniest had caught on and no one who considers themselves a sauce master wants to be associated even by mistake with the corny! (function of style being a social read, of course there are Jedi types who stay the course with whatever their sartorial north star is no matter whether it's trendy or not and are never chased off their territory by encroaching lames BUT most of us aren't that high-minded and I'm not too proud to admit it)
They're still the dominant fit among a majority of non-fashion-insider type people, but the reverse was true in 2008 when every under-25 worth their fashion salt was encased in skinny denim (though not the jegging kind) so that shift in the male jean/trouser silhouette is going to take some time to happen, namely as long as it takes for the corny or otherwise unpleasant to relinquish them and for a new generation to rediscover them. Abandonment is an essential part of the trend cycle too!
Skinny pants are out for the foreseeable future because the style has been co-opted by the corniest people of our time. It's REALLY HARD to make a skinny pant look good/proportional with well fitting clothes without buying all elastic everything, and at that point you not only look unstylish, you also look like you're wearing your little brother's clothes
However, it's also really hard to make capacious pants look good (in that "professional" way) the way slim/straight-fit pants do; the latter are very accommodating in terms of proportion and fit! Personally speaking, straight fit is as wide as I'll ever go, both because my wardrobe doesn't work with a more elephantine silhouette, but also because I ride my bike just about everywhere and can't afford to get the pants cuff caught in the cogs
Also, I gotta say: I've had a wide pants hangover since high school, when I owned basically nothing but skater jeans and one pair of JNCOs. Seeing the youth dress like my friends did when I was a stupid teen always makes me vaguely queasy, like I'm seeing something I shouldn't. Mind you, I think youths should dress as goofily as possible (that's what being a youth is for!), but it's definitely not my mug of matcha
we seem to always be comparing skinny to baggy, but what about straight? they never really look dated - i can look back on almost every decade i've been alive and recognize them in the style lexicon. prob because they provide the balance we seek when wearing more voluminous tops, but don't necessitate them as a skinny pant does...
Thank you for this article, and huge congrats on the NYT feature. It made me reflect on how tricky it is to really nail the fit on a pair of pants. I'm sitting here in a pair of olive straight cut herringbone work pants from Corridor, and to be honest I was a few eBay taps away from unloading this pair last year because I thought the leg opening was "too wide." Somehow I persevered, and pushed my personal boundaries, and they've become my BEST-FITTING PANTS. The combination of the straight cut, substantial-but-not-too-heavy drape, and cinch-able waist are a killer combination.
Even with advances in AI, achieving the right break on a pair of pants somehow remains an intricate balancing act - too long and everything's bunched, too short and you are the equivalent of a pant-wearing "Fred", and mamma mia when you swap out low-cut sneaks for boots everything can go haywire. Writing this Comment, I also realize it's easy to get caught up in the technical details of fabric weight, inseam lengths, cuts, and so on, and lose sight of the enjoyment of getting it right.
One element that didn't get covered too extensively is time-and-place. When I'm out to dinner with my folks and the lady, perhaps the slightly trimmer look makes me feel most comfortable. And when I'm walking around town on a Saturday afternoon, maybe I want to let the leg openings flutter in the wind a bit more. This adds yet another dimension to the complexity of nailing the right fit, but also presents an opportunity to utilize different widths on different occasions, which does feel freeing.
I’ll always love wide leg pants, but I don’t love hemming them to match the height of a specific shoe. In that sense, wide legs can be pretty limiting. I wonder if skinny pants may never fully recede in part because they allow for total shoe height / pant break freedom.
Sick newsletter as always !!
Never really rocked skinnies as a youth (cause I was too young) but it’s crazy to remember how Cheap Monday had a chokehold on cool baby rocker European youth !! It was part of the wave mixing skinny vintage and brands like AA and April 77, with this weird reinterpretation of the “rock” aesthetic through the 50 to the 90s, which feels non-existent today and outdated (except maybe for the use of hardcore aesthetics), but it might very well comeback
And love the Royal cheese shout!
I feel like this article and your one before about aging out of certain looks goes hand in hand. Although I am in much better shape now than I am when I was rocking skinny-er jeans, as I get older, comfort is king, really hard to sit down for a long chat with an old friend when your junk is getting crushed for an hour. My other hesitation with the skinny jean coming back is, with the crappier manufacturing and materials the future likely brings, ass seam tears will be inevitable!
one thing skinny pants will never have is max utility. easy to rock big pants in the mountains or climbing gym and then step back into the city looking great. can’t imagine going back to hindering my movement with tiny pants….
Fit preferences aside, big slappers will always have an edge over slims in the intrigue dept. That extra fabric creates (literal) space for architectural tailoring moments and getting freaky with materials. I look at a brand like 18 east and can’t imagine any of those fabrics cut down to a slim silhouette, wrestling my calves with each step (maybe I just don’t have the vision?). I can’t say with total certainty that I’ll never buy another pair of petit standards, but I’m definitely never rockin another pair of slim fit corduroys.
I have rocked my black skinnies tucked into knee high boots in an equestrian sort of look once recently. I don’t think it looked amazing but I was having a hard day and it was comforting.
Recently got a pair of straight Denham jeans in Amsterdam. They feel skinny in our big pants world but look sooo sexy and feel transgressive. Also got a pair of ultra low rise flared true religions off poshmark for like $20 during lockdown times. The zipper is legit 1in! I think I also recently donated them in an adderall induced closet clearing fury (off my meds now BH, didn’t work for me), and was sad because I wanted to wear them last weekend and couldn’t find them :( might repurchase for a few reasons.
Denham straight jeans: https://www.denham.com/us-en/collection/women-straight-fit/
I will say, Jonah, I like both of your fits in the picture above. Me? I probably hit the middle of the road compared to you as far as pants—neither skinny nor max width. Does that make me 'never in fashion but never out of fashion,' either? I feel confident in what I rock, which goes as far as being in style or having the right brands of the moment. I was wearing JNCO in the 90s, Tsubi's in the 00s and now, Japanese raw with some decent leg room. Awesome write up by the way!
I love a wide-legged pant, particularly ones with pleating and a belt to dress up or down. I wore a pair with big ol' swish to an event this weekend with a simple tucked-in solid shirt and mary jane flats and felt sharp as hell.
Slim-straight-leg cuffed jeans over boots on men or women have me in a chokehold, though. I still like this look when it's rugged. The jeans can't be TOO slim, though, and I prefer lace-up boots with this fit.
If you look back on an article in The Cut from around 2012 where they paid homage to my style icon, Katherine Hepburn, she pretty much always rocked the larger trousers. From the 30s to the 80s, her pants always leaned more towards baggy or flowy, nary a skinny cigarette style in sight. Sure she had some straighter leg cuts, but they still had movement. I think one can stick to a pants style across decades. I never owned a single pair of skinny or flared pants, ever. So maybe I’m just trying to justify my style. LOL.
I’ll honestly never tire of talking about pants - I need therapy. I personally do not ever see myself wearing skinnies again, as I don’t feel they suit my body type. I’m much broader on top and look as though I’m about to fall over when wearing skinnies. I’m also super tired of them - they never really left for many people.
Words of wisdom! Would also love to hear your thoughts (and perhaps Erin can weigh in) on how shirt fits (both horizontal and vertical) are changing in response to larger pants fits. Especially for women’s fits — if ladies are wearing large pants slung low, and especially if we don’t want to be showing midriff for whatever reason, where should our shirts be hitting our hips? And do shirts need to be wider or narrower to balance out the larger fit on the bottom half? Really struggling with this. Would make a great follow up piece.
like ELK says above, the 'out'ness of skinnies isn't just a 'how do they work' problem, it's an associations problem - they started off c. 2004-06 being worn by the cooler parts of Young Hollywood and the kind of people who would be photographed on street style blogs when those were legit, by 2016 even the corniest had caught on and no one who considers themselves a sauce master wants to be associated even by mistake with the corny! (function of style being a social read, of course there are Jedi types who stay the course with whatever their sartorial north star is no matter whether it's trendy or not and are never chased off their territory by encroaching lames BUT most of us aren't that high-minded and I'm not too proud to admit it)
They're still the dominant fit among a majority of non-fashion-insider type people, but the reverse was true in 2008 when every under-25 worth their fashion salt was encased in skinny denim (though not the jegging kind) so that shift in the male jean/trouser silhouette is going to take some time to happen, namely as long as it takes for the corny or otherwise unpleasant to relinquish them and for a new generation to rediscover them. Abandonment is an essential part of the trend cycle too!
Skinny pants are out for the foreseeable future because the style has been co-opted by the corniest people of our time. It's REALLY HARD to make a skinny pant look good/proportional with well fitting clothes without buying all elastic everything, and at that point you not only look unstylish, you also look like you're wearing your little brother's clothes
However, it's also really hard to make capacious pants look good (in that "professional" way) the way slim/straight-fit pants do; the latter are very accommodating in terms of proportion and fit! Personally speaking, straight fit is as wide as I'll ever go, both because my wardrobe doesn't work with a more elephantine silhouette, but also because I ride my bike just about everywhere and can't afford to get the pants cuff caught in the cogs
Also, I gotta say: I've had a wide pants hangover since high school, when I owned basically nothing but skater jeans and one pair of JNCOs. Seeing the youth dress like my friends did when I was a stupid teen always makes me vaguely queasy, like I'm seeing something I shouldn't. Mind you, I think youths should dress as goofily as possible (that's what being a youth is for!), but it's definitely not my mug of matcha
we seem to always be comparing skinny to baggy, but what about straight? they never really look dated - i can look back on almost every decade i've been alive and recognize them in the style lexicon. prob because they provide the balance we seek when wearing more voluminous tops, but don't necessitate them as a skinny pant does...
Skinny(ish) pants are already happening on the women's side of the aisle. I refer to the High Sport Kick Flare (and dupes) phenomenon, which is dominating all my feeds. See, for example, Totally Recommend https://totallyrecommend.substack.com/p/the-scoop-on-the-high-sport-dupe
Sarah's Retail Diary https://sarahshapiro.substack.com/p/retail-diary-fashion-spiral-kick
and The Love List https://www.thelovelist.wtf/p/are-high-sport-pants-worth-it