Until the last few years, would have called Dries Van Noten women's wear "timeless" or at least trend resistant. He just riffed on the same jackets slim skirts, sweaters, and classic coat shapes, but with different beautiful fabrics and details. Along with Margaret Howell (similar shapes, totally different materials) he has been my long time favorite.
Great discussion of an important problem. What can we as citizens and consumers do about it? I personally don't really want to buy pants again. In the US, a round of new sumptuary laws would unfortunately run afoul of the 1st Amendment. But maybe the EU as a "regulatory superpower" can act. As fashion is now so globalized, clothes-wearers in other jurisdictions could also benefit.
The need for timelessness feels like the refusal to accept that the future will change and you will inevitably be on the outside looking in. It’s not under your control, but you desperately want it to be. Oh man life is scary and unpredictable but at least I’ve got the best timeless chinos in all 3 versatile colors from bonobos! I’m freed from the tyranny of worrying about that again.
This was so good. Coming off of a year of milestone birthday celebrations and preparing for a year of another, I’ve been looking a lot at old photos and noticed that when I get really excited about something I’m wearing it is because it feels true to me - not timeless, because I have changed and morphed across just about every possible axis, but more so feels *consistent* to my soul. Thanks for the giving words to my feelings.
Re: the Harrington, does this have a touch of the unswaggy valley in it?
Steve McQueen looks dope in the jacket, so the look gets copied by everyone until CEOs at corporate days out are wearing them, and therefore the initial impact of Steve McQueen wearing one is lost.
could be... hard to say from the vantage point of the present (and there are other more subcultural adoptions of the harrington in the punk-era UK) but real talk i think even big steve was much better served by other garments
Love this, great read. One thing that stands out to me is the difference between timeless in a general sense, and timeless to you. I’m sure most of us have items that we’ve rocked with abandon for years and through trend cycles, because they are a timeless pillar of our own personal swag. For me, that’s nice and loose blue button ups. Got maybe 5 of them that have been getting wear since I was a teenager. If you have good sense of your own personal style, you can absolutely buy timeless items that you’ll love forever. It’s when you start looking for items that will stay in the zeitgeist forever that you’re really blowing it imo. Harringtons are insanely crook too, good shout
I think this works in reverse too! There are no timelessly wack styles either — I think the longer something isn’t cool the more time it has to build up SPE (swag potential energy). Think crocs or keens or sketchers (I think you talked about sketchers a couple months ago), for the longest time they were lame as fuck but eventually it wraps back around.
I think for me when I am buying into a "timeless style" ideology, it's less to achieve the unachievable and more just trying to make the most of a budget when I am very interested in fashion typically out of my socio-economic sphere. Like splurging will likely end up on something that might be better described as universal than timeless, something in a cut that works with my long ass torso, probably in black simply because I would like to get the most out of the garm whereas when I am keen on a freaky color or cut, I'll often times pass just because the outfit ratio is off and would require other pieces to really pop off!
Timelessness suggests some unholy stasis. Protecting unscuffed sneakers. A wirehanger suit in a cellophane garment bag. Trying one more time to fit into your wedding dress.
The allure of timelessness is to exist in that moment forever. To be solved. But we are not. We wear them out of the store, and they are ours for that moment.
Is it that "timeless style" is a lie, or more so that it's not attainable when motivated by an aversion to being dated? Going off of your Howell example, it's not the results of any specific choice at a particular time that create the Gibraltar/icon, but rather cultivating the gumption and ability to choose according to one's own will over time (informed by, but not in accordance with, the trends du jour).
"wearing what other people say" in the strictest most literal sense would not be satisfying, but there's an intrinsic social component to clothes where you are indeed never just "dressing for yourself" ... it's what can make it tense, interesting, challenging, frustrating, dumb, exhilarating
I appreciate your thoughts, it's a very interesting reflection!
It's interesting how Proust's approach, especially the second point, talks about how you are indeed dressing for others even if you're fully true to yourself. "Signifier not only of someone's place in life but of their 'aura' or ethos." Signifier to whom? If we lived in a vacuum we wouldn't need to signify anything to anyone, but we do not live in a vacuum and thus even when we wear what makes us happy most of the time we're also dressing to be read and seen as something by others.
Until the last few years, would have called Dries Van Noten women's wear "timeless" or at least trend resistant. He just riffed on the same jackets slim skirts, sweaters, and classic coat shapes, but with different beautiful fabrics and details. Along with Margaret Howell (similar shapes, totally different materials) he has been my long time favorite.
Great discussion of an important problem. What can we as citizens and consumers do about it? I personally don't really want to buy pants again. In the US, a round of new sumptuary laws would unfortunately run afoul of the 1st Amendment. But maybe the EU as a "regulatory superpower" can act. As fashion is now so globalized, clothes-wearers in other jurisdictions could also benefit.
The need for timelessness feels like the refusal to accept that the future will change and you will inevitably be on the outside looking in. It’s not under your control, but you desperately want it to be. Oh man life is scary and unpredictable but at least I’ve got the best timeless chinos in all 3 versatile colors from bonobos! I’m freed from the tyranny of worrying about that again.
This was so good. Coming off of a year of milestone birthday celebrations and preparing for a year of another, I’ve been looking a lot at old photos and noticed that when I get really excited about something I’m wearing it is because it feels true to me - not timeless, because I have changed and morphed across just about every possible axis, but more so feels *consistent* to my soul. Thanks for the giving words to my feelings.
nice way to feel about a garment !
Re: the Harrington, does this have a touch of the unswaggy valley in it?
Steve McQueen looks dope in the jacket, so the look gets copied by everyone until CEOs at corporate days out are wearing them, and therefore the initial impact of Steve McQueen wearing one is lost.
could be... hard to say from the vantage point of the present (and there are other more subcultural adoptions of the harrington in the punk-era UK) but real talk i think even big steve was much better served by other garments
Love this, great read. One thing that stands out to me is the difference between timeless in a general sense, and timeless to you. I’m sure most of us have items that we’ve rocked with abandon for years and through trend cycles, because they are a timeless pillar of our own personal swag. For me, that’s nice and loose blue button ups. Got maybe 5 of them that have been getting wear since I was a teenager. If you have good sense of your own personal style, you can absolutely buy timeless items that you’ll love forever. It’s when you start looking for items that will stay in the zeitgeist forever that you’re really blowing it imo. Harringtons are insanely crook too, good shout
I like that
Though I still recommend “periodic stress tests of your own swag structural integrity” https://www.blackbirdspyplane.com/p/yes-you-should-dress-your-age
I think this works in reverse too! There are no timelessly wack styles either — I think the longer something isn’t cool the more time it has to build up SPE (swag potential energy). Think crocs or keens or sketchers (I think you talked about sketchers a couple months ago), for the longest time they were lame as fuck but eventually it wraps back around.
Extremely true
Except possibly fedoras 😜
Just wait until the mobster revival era. Possibly post tariff-induced depression. 2040s we’ll all be looking like goons from an ep of Batman.
Beautifully written… so very enjoyable! Thank you.
Damn my ass was TOASTED on this one, mad respect!
I think for me when I am buying into a "timeless style" ideology, it's less to achieve the unachievable and more just trying to make the most of a budget when I am very interested in fashion typically out of my socio-economic sphere. Like splurging will likely end up on something that might be better described as universal than timeless, something in a cut that works with my long ass torso, probably in black simply because I would like to get the most out of the garm whereas when I am keen on a freaky color or cut, I'll often times pass just because the outfit ratio is off and would require other pieces to really pop off!
having a sense of cuts and colors that suit your body and letting that guide you makes total sense !
Immutability is an unnatural state.
Timelessness suggests some unholy stasis. Protecting unscuffed sneakers. A wirehanger suit in a cellophane garment bag. Trying one more time to fit into your wedding dress.
The allure of timelessness is to exist in that moment forever. To be solved. But we are not. We wear them out of the store, and they are ours for that moment.
The only thing beyond perfection, is destruction.
unholy !!
Is it that "timeless style" is a lie, or more so that it's not attainable when motivated by an aversion to being dated? Going off of your Howell example, it's not the results of any specific choice at a particular time that create the Gibraltar/icon, but rather cultivating the gumption and ability to choose according to one's own will over time (informed by, but not in accordance with, the trends du jour).
in the essay i'm using howell as a paragon of consistency as a virtue distinct from "timelessness"
Another profound banger from Mr spyplane. Thank you! Really had me reflecting with this one.
"wearing what other people say" in the strictest most literal sense would not be satisfying, but there's an intrinsic social component to clothes where you are indeed never just "dressing for yourself" ... it's what can make it tense, interesting, challenging, frustrating, dumb, exhilarating
I appreciate your thoughts, it's a very interesting reflection!
It's interesting how Proust's approach, especially the second point, talks about how you are indeed dressing for others even if you're fully true to yourself. "Signifier not only of someone's place in life but of their 'aura' or ethos." Signifier to whom? If we lived in a vacuum we wouldn't need to signify anything to anyone, but we do not live in a vacuum and thus even when we wear what makes us happy most of the time we're also dressing to be read and seen as something by others.